Wardialer From United States, joined Sep 2001, 937 posts, RR: 0 Posted (2 months 3 weeks 2 days ago) and read 2845 times:
Hi everyone,
It seems no good news in regards to the US economy and it will get worse says analysts.
In my opinion, and please, correct me if Im wrong, that Europe will be the super-power (along with Asia) of the world. By this saying, is that since the EURO is getting stronger in currency, it means that European countries will have the best economy power than the US.
For example, in Hungary, the economy is the best and its booming like crazy because the Forint currency, is the stongest in history....Hence....even Hungary and all of Eastern Europe is doing far well better than the USA.
So I think there will be no fix to the sinking economy in the US....and thats because of outsourcing....
Thats why the US has a few corporations thats on their soil but 80% of those companies are outsourced...
PlaneWasted From Sweden, joined Jan 2008, 245 posts, RR: 0 Reply 2, posted (2 months 3 weeks 1 day 21 hours ago) and read 2768 times:
US economy is maybe going down, but why should that mean that it is impossible to recover?
Change some habits and strategies and it will become better. The population is well educated and americans arn't more stupid that anyone else.
But don't sit on your hands doing nothing thinking the problems will be solved by themselves.
Francoflier From France, joined Oct 2001, 1360 posts, RR: 3 Reply 4, posted (2 months 3 weeks 1 day 20 hours ago) and read 2731 times:
Quoting Wardialer (Thread starter): that Europe will be the super-power (along with Asia) of the world.
Europe has a looooong way to go to achieve any kind of coherent and unified governing body that will allow it to have the diplomatic and economic influence on the world the US has.
Progress has been tremendous, but it's still no more than a bunch of very different countries that have facilitated exchange of goods and people amongst themselves, helped by a common currency.
Asia is also quite the motley crew of states which are far from speaking from a single voice, and are all still very much influenced, economically, by other countries, although their economies are booming.
A strong economy and currency is not the only criteria considered in the definition of a 'super-power'. The US is here to stay, and hopefully the next administration can do its bit to curve the failing finances.
Looks like I picked the wrong week to quit posting...
If it ever happens to you, pal, then come back and answer that question.
The fact you even ask that question makes me want to throw up. I guess, to you, there's nothing wrong wth taking good paying American jobs, with good benefits, and giving them to another nation, forcing your own countrymen to then look for jobs that don't pay nearly as wel,and with less benefits.
If you call that progress, then I pity you. That kind of attitude, imho, is as anti-American as one can get.
Derico From Argentina, joined Dec 1999, 3214 posts, RR: 6 Reply 6, posted (2 months 3 weeks 1 day 20 hours ago) and read 2718 times:
Not a sinking ship, but one that has been 'on tour' without repairs for way too long.
The United States is a complete fiscal mess, with very poor fiscal and monetary decision at the moment, perhaps the poorest in 90 years. For example, two weeks ago it was informed that the US military would reactivate a fleet of warships to patrol the South Atlantic...
Usually, that would have prompted a massive outcry and criticism by South American nations, but this time the reaction was extremely muted, even from Venezuela (current US nemesis in SA), and Argentina, which has always been lukewarm to the United States. Even Brazil with it's aspirations of regional superpower didn't make much of it. Why?
Because deep inside the halls of power in those countries, they KNOW the US is in no shape to be parading ships that consume millions of barrels of oil, and cost billions of dollars, indefinately when there is no reason to do so in the South Atlantic Ocean... specially with major presidential elections coming up. So why is Bush doing this now? He gave no explanations. Then again, South American countries didn't really demand much of one as they usually would have.
The thinking is: if the US wants to spend even more oil and treasure on a pointless ''I'm still a superpower'' shoutout, and blow even more holes in it's budget and economy, go right ahead. "We" already know you are still a military superpower.
What we do know is that such pointless spending is an example of things that costing the United States TERRIBLY at home in crumbling infraestructure, and in the future of US children.
What the US is doing right now is suicide: they are buying incredibly expensive oil from the Middle East, expensive commodities from Asia and Latin America, imported fashion from Europe and electronics from Japan with a 50% devalued US dollar.
This trade imbalance fills up the vaults of all these nations with billions in currency reserves... almost all of whom then TURN AROUND and purchase an increasing float of US debt that country needs to sustain it's bloated budget. So in essence, American consumers are to some extent financing out of their own pockets the increase in their foreign debt which is being bought by foreign savings.
Putting money (or credit card debt) towards increasing your own nation's debt is not exactly the smartest economic policy. Bottom line the US has a lot of problems, that are very fixable, but I think they lack political will as well as social will to make changes. They are not unique in this though, most nations have change forced upon them when things become unsustainable.
In life one acquires much experience in being a novice.
LTBEWR From United States, joined Jan 2004, 8415 posts, RR: 16 Reply 7, posted (2 months 3 weeks 1 day 20 hours ago) and read 2698 times:
There is no doubt that the good ship USA has taken on a lot of water and may floundering a bit, but it is far from sinking. That 'sinking' can be avoided if it's citizens make good decisions from consumer choices to leadership.
All of us in the USA must face certain realities. We must all start to live simpler lives within our means. No more big, fuel guzzling vehicles. Much smaller houses. Reduce personal debt. Be less greedy as to wanting money and stuff. Save to buy something rather than use easy credit. Not try to 'keep up with the Jones'. We also need to make more healthy choices in our consumption of food, reducing our excesses there with it's waste and health care impact.
We must challenge our leaders to make tough decisions and live with them including as to oil/energy use, to accept higher taxes to pay for our debts, to put in sound regulations to reduce future risks. Improve our schools systems. Make college affordable without huge debt. We must have a total revamping our our health care systems so no one is unable to get care due to the costs and is affordable for all.
We must stop the exporting of jobs and industry and indeed return some of it.
We must also end our war in Iraq - we can't afford it, they don't want us (at least our military forces) there anyway and it just reinforces more expensive hate against the USA. We also must back down as to threats against Iran and take our fight against al-Quada in Afghanistan.
We went through a similar crises in the 1970's - and we survived. We can get through this and be a stronger country in a different and better way.
Duff44 From United States, joined Apr 2006, 1723 posts, RR: 0 Reply 8, posted (2 months 3 weeks 1 day 19 hours ago) and read 2659 times:
Quoting LTBEWR (Reply 7): to accept higher taxes to pay for our debts
I agree with everything you said except that. If our government was 100% lean and still couldn't meet all of the obligations it needed to, then you would have a point. But when we do not actively close tax-haven loopholes and outright waste spending on earmarked projects, a tax increase is counterproductive.
But trusting Congress with money is like trusting a child molester to watch your kids... you won't see any improvement until it personally affects them, and since they're all rich it won't.
Thorben From Germany, joined Sep 2005, 2898 posts, RR: 3 Reply 9, posted (2 months 3 weeks 1 day 18 hours ago) and read 2621 times:
The US has a lot of problems.
-Large fiscal deficit
-Large trade deficit
-Old infrastructure
-Many private households in deep debt
-One percent of the population in prison
-Large gap between rich and poor
-Large parts of the world are angry at the US and its Hippocratic foreign policy
to name a few. If I was nasty, I'd say they should rather elect an insolvency administrator than a president. The hole is deep, has been dug by wrong way of acting in a lot of years, it will take a long time to come out of it.
Democracy means the people control the government. When the government controls the people, it is a dictatorship.
Nothing. We should outsource our government today, this very hour. We could probably hire a Senate and House in Guatemala for about the salary of a single Senator. They could not possibly do a worse job and we could actually fire them (unlike the ones we have now) if they didn't do their job well.
As for outsourcing private sector concerns. It makes life better only for the real owners of corporations. Those of us who own "common stock" in those corporations might see a little gain, but we are mostly a buffer between the fat cats and any consequences from increasing unemployment.
The next bad thing about outsourcing is that the product SUCKS and there isn't a damn thing I can do about it other than buy a competing, equally sucky outsourced product. I've spent days and days shopping for an alternative to Chinese crap product and concluded that no such thing is available. In some cases I would cheerfully pay ten times the retail price to find such a thing. I have a machine shop building me a tripod right now because every store in town carries only Chinese crap. My tripod is going to cost more than $300 instead of the $15 or so for a Chinese POS but the latter will wobble.
That's what is wrong with outsourcing.
Original question:
Globalization. The dollar is probably being deliberately driven down right now by ecoterrorists having nothing to do with radical religion. Billionaires in other countries want to own some of our assets and are finding them a bargain.
One day we will do what a hundred other nations have done to us and to our citizens. We will just "nationalize" their investments right out from under them and the playing field will be more or less level again.
Some of you may consider me a rightie because you are so blinded by partisan politics or don't read my posts carefully but I've lost friends from the right by maintaining that capitalism is as evil as communism. It just works slightly better and I can't think of a better -ism. Business school brainwashees snicker and toss out buzzword-grenades but the most important thing a corporation can produce is jobs. The product is just an excuse. The jobs create the market, dummies! Henry Ford understood that and changed the world. He knew that people just like his employees were the market.
The private sector has no rights which the government is bound to respect.
PlaneWasted From Sweden, joined Jan 2008, 245 posts, RR: 0 Reply 12, posted (2 months 3 weeks 1 day 17 hours ago) and read 2551 times:
Quoting SlamClick (Reply 10): As for outsourcing private sector concerns. It makes life better only for the real owners of corporations.
I don't agree. A country should do what it is good at compared to other countries. A company using outsourcing will have an advantage over a non-outsouring one, IF it is done right. I think the US companies would find it very hard to compete with European and Asian companies if they were not allowed to outsource. Then there would not be any American companies at all after a while...
SlamClick From United States, joined Nov 2003, 9910 posts, RR: 72 Reply 16, posted (2 months 3 weeks 1 day 16 hours ago) and read 2494 times:
Quoting NoUFO (Reply 13): Ask your local retailer to stock up on Cullmann tripods.
I can see at a glance that those, no matter where they are made, are too spindly to be stable with my long lens.
Quoting Cadet57 (Reply 15): Or Gitzo. Im pretty sure those arent chinese made.
Unfortunately for them I can have one scratch-built cheaper. So much for the economy argument for outsourcing. I can have a one-off built from raw materials by a local business owner for less money than I can buy their manufactured product.
Outsourcing apparently only has merit where the customer base can be conditioned to accept total garbage as a product.
Quoting PlaneWasted (Reply 12): think the US companies would find it very hard to compete with European and Asian companies if they were not allowed to outsource. Then there would not be any American companies at all after a while...
That is an illusion caused by the utterly contrived international markets. I sometimes wonder who is paying our Congressional salaries because they certainly don't serve us. In almost any commodity you can name the US pays more tariffs to other countries than they pay to us for what they ship. Same with user fees like port charges or airport landing fees. Australia, just for one example used to charge us about ten times what we charged them for the same event - a 747 operation. If all tariffs were, by international treaty 100% reciprocal you'd see a world you wouldn't even recognize and the only reason it is the way it is now is because the thousand or so wealthiest people are non-nationals. They can move their fortunes around in ways unavailable to you and me.
The private sector has no rights which the government is bound to respect.
AirStairs From United States, joined Jul 2008, 248 posts, RR: 0 Reply 17, posted (2 months 3 weeks 1 day 14 hours ago) and read 2440 times:
The title of this thread seems a little dramatic to me.
Quoting Wardialer (Thread starter): In my opinion, and please, correct me if Im wrong, that Europe will be the super-power (along with Asia) of the world. By this saying, is that since the EURO is getting stronger in currency, it means that European countries will have the best economy power than the US.
With all due respect, you are wrong. It is some myth that congressmen would have you believe that China and India are swallowing up the world's money and energy and the US dollar will fall into oblivion. China and India's demand is quickly picking up pace, but the education of their workforces is still pitiful by western standards. The burgeoning Chinese and Indian middle classes that we continue to hear about threatening our oil security and weakening the dollar, make about the equivalent of $9 a day.
The Euro zone is strong but suffers from much of what the US does. The Euro is overvalued at estimates of around 30%, while analysts see the dollar undervalued. Yes, analysts are not and should not be unequivocally trusted. But per company research (proprietary so I won't name it), currencies will only correct about 12% per year, much slower than, say, an equity. Tighter monetary controls and market correction over time with put the dollar and euro in closer concert.
Quoting Francoflier (Reply 4): Europe has a looooong way to go to achieve any kind of coherent and unified governing body that will allow it to have the diplomatic and economic influence on the world the US has.
Aside from economic power, in which the aggregate Eurozone comes close to rivaling the US (but certainly does not operate as coherently), much more factors in to a status as world superpower, including (disappointingly or not) military clout that most of Europe does not have and seems unwilling to put forth (that is their prerogative).
Quoting Falcon84 (Reply 5): If it ever happens to you, pal, then come back and answer that question.
The fact you even ask that question makes me want to throw up. I guess, to you, there's nothing wrong wth taking good paying American jobs, with good benefits, and giving them to another nation, forcing your own countrymen to then look for jobs that don't pay nearly as wel,and with less benefits.
If you call that progress, then I pity you. That kind of attitude, imho, is as anti-American as one can get.
It is painful progress, but a system that (if ironically) duly increases our standard of living with one hand as it takes our jobs with the other. I would not wish on anyone that their job be lost, whether it was handed to a foreign national or not. The reality is that a free market will seek the lowest costs of input possible in order to lower prices, garner market share, and maximize return. If you put a damper on this, you hinder economic growth across the board.
American industry is shrinking but still exists. It would be of more benefit it ourselves were we to insure that a huge variety of education disciplines were available to citizens of all means, as training a competitive workforce is the only real way out of the slump.
Quoting Thorben (Reply 9): -Large fiscal deficit
-Large trade deficit
-Old infrastructure
-Many private households in deep debt
-One percent of the population in prison
-Large gap between rich and poor
-Large parts of the world are angry at the US and its Hippocratic foreign policy
These are issues that most if not all countries are facing in some way or another, consumer debt being one that the US is particularly stung with. A weak dollar should help the trade deficit in the medium term. I can't agree on your point of infrastructure, though: it is not perfect but extremely reliable. There is not trash lining the streets like in Napoli and civic employee strikes are almost unheard of, in contrast to those in France and the like.
The media is in the business of sensationalising and speculating. I take this with a huge chunk of salt.
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